Author Topic: Service removed then added again to already drawn content causing fatal error  (Read 592 times)

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Offline ChrisHTopic starter

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We had a service drawn with the wrong specification.  The fabrication database was reloaded with the correct service and specification causing the already drawn itms to show up without a service.

We can use the dropdown menu to select the correct service but when we apply it to the itm it throws a fatal error an closes  Revit.  Any thoughts to why?  I'm not 100% sure how my detailer was able to reload without including a service that was drawn but as it stands now I can see both services are loaded and working and the existing already stuff has a specification but no service.  Everything else is working as expected.  The fatal error only occurs when trying to assign the service.

Offline Axl

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I would revert back to a backup model, add the new service as an additional service (I never touch an existing service once it is used) then once you have both services old and new in the palette, just change service of the fittings to the new one, design fabrication should take care of the fitting replacements
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Offline DotNet

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Changing service via the drop down only works between specs that have identical templates. Geometry changes are not allowed. This isn't very useful barring changing supply to return for example, if and only if their templates are identical.

This does however provide a round about way to change a service name, since changing a service's name in the DB directly will bracket the service and orphan the parts. For example we can copy a service, change the copy's name, then use the drop down to switch to the copied, renamed service. The services are still "identical".

The only Autodesk supported way to make geometry modifying service changes is to use the Change Service tool via the Modify Tab. This will completely replace all parts with new parts, providing wildly undesirable results, wiping out any data, custom dimensions, data, tags and numbers that existed on the previous parts.

In many cases where a service change seems required, what we are really after is a specification, and/or a material change. With Virtual Mechanical, we can do both. Check out this YouTube video covering the VM Fab Properties Palette, including making specification, material, and service changes.

Offline ChrisHTopic starter

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Thank you, I'm going to keep digging.  I'm still not 100% sure how this happened.

The spec +2wg and service was +2'' EA

The spec should be -2wg and service should be -2'' EA

So from a geometry stand point and the service template on the fabrication side.  They are the same. From what I'm being told everything was fine until they switched loaded configuration for + to - and renamed it negative.

All the duct that was +2'' still shows as +2'' for a spec and everything looks great except there is no service.  Its just blank.  When I click on an itm the change service button in the ribbon is gray but the drop down in the property's is available and I'm able to select the correct service.   Then I click apply after selecting a service that's when the fatal error pops up and Revit crashes

Offline DotNet

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Since making service changes in Revit is so painful, it makes me question the standard practice of linking services directly to a single specification and/or material. For example "SUPPLY  AIR - GALVANIZED - 4"WG. I understand the reasoning, it's just that it makes specification and material changes (which are common enough) relatively difficult to say the least.

Offline Darren Young

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You "Should" be able to rename a service. Service and Spec...not tried that.

But "Should" doesn't always work as intended.  I've seen evidence boots on the ground of things that I can't repeat in a test environment.

I once renamed every ITM nd folder, fixed the services and reloaded. Everything worked remarkably well. At least in my small sample data set.

I think the better way to have managed this was to NOT rename the service/spec. Rather create a new Service/Spec, get both loaded, then change service, then remove the other one. This itself would likely mean a little cleanup...re-optimize straights....stretch throats....but I think Revit would likely been a little more tolerant.

Version comes into play as well....newer versions (theoretically) manage this better.

Another way to help is use versioning. Versioning your Specs, Service, ITMs, Materials etc can help shepherd in those changes a little ore gracefully.

That said, most people don't understand versioning let alone use it. It can be a pain. And frankly, it often broke things too only because nobody except me was dumb enough to use it to get bug reports in for fixes. So it should be better now....because of my stupidity in using it. :-)

Offline DotNet

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Using Revit 2023.0.11.19 with Revit Imperial Content v2.4 and CADmep 2023. Renaming a service will bracket the service in Revit. I haven't seen this behavior change from version to version.


Offline Darren Young

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Using Revit 2023.0.11.19 with Revit Imperial Content v2.4 and CADmep 2023. Renaming a service will bracket the service in Revit. I haven't seen this behavior change from version to version.

Thanks for that Steven.  I know I've seen that happen before but last time I tried, I couldn't get it to do that.

I'll try again and get in front of Autodesk's Dev team. I literally just had a call on this a few weeks ago.